Britains Re-paints Recast

[Cardigan600]

Yo Troopers, dont think this subject has ever been discussed on the forum, and that is how we rate Britains re-paints & recast Soldiers. To start probably two thirds of Old Britains are shot, so the choice is bin them or repair & repaint them. Now if you have a piece of old furniture and get it stripped & re-polished it loses very little value, because of its age say Victorian or earlier & its rarity, but when it comes to saving & repainting Old Britains rare items its frowned upon and loses a lot of its value. At the moment on ebay there are many enhanced sets (see photo) these started life as the 4th Hussars and enhanced into the 11th Hussars, and I think even the painters on the forum would agree they are excellent, painted far better than the original Old Britains which I have to say were very poorly painted, because they were mass produced and for the kids to play with, so the painting was not an important part of the sale of Britains Soldiers. Take my set # 1 the Lifeguards mint in box, but when you look at the paint they are a nightmare white paint half way up the sabres red paint off the jackets on the Cuirass's etc. I think they used Jeffs Distemper brush for their painting. So the question is will Britains re-paints ever be accepted for the superb artwork they have ie: if you have been watching Jeffs work on the 18th Hussars & 7th Dragoons you will see what I mean. By the way only mention Jeff because of the work he has done for me, I know there are many skilled guys on the forum so not leaving you guys out, you do some great work. So what about recast I think its great that they are made, to many Toy Soldier makers have gone to the wall, and its great to see the molds being re-used to carry on our hobby. Brad, 4th Hussar & Jeff were discussing Soldier-pac molds dont know the firm but by the sounds of it they made excellent items. I personally think re-paints & recast done to a high standard should be accepted and rated as highly if not higher than the original badly painted items. If you want to see the other sets this ebay seller has for sale all enhanced this photo is item # 280257855920, he has some nice looking sets. Lets know what you think about these comments guys, its a subject that should be addressed.
Bernard.

[aujj65]

These are really well painted.

I think that if any figure is in a sorry state (and as such isn't worth much) a repaint is certainly the way to go. I've no idea about the rare figures, so I guess I would leave those alone (actually, I would repaint them :eek:.......No, not really :D)

Jeff

[Dickbuttons]

I have to agree with Jeff -- if the Britains figure is battered and chipped, a repaint may be the way to go. On the other hand, you can purchase certain Britains reproductions from certain dealers, like London bridge Toys in Pennsylvania.

[4th Hussar]

My collection includes original WBs, recasts and obvious copies. Since I enjoy the look and feel of old toy soldiers all have a place in my collection. In some cases I would never be able to justify spending what it would cost for an original WB set so the recast,repaint, copy allows me to own a cherished set ( naval landing party, staff car, Egyptian camel corps).

If I had access to a talented painter I would seriously consider purchasing casting and commissioning a unique set like our friend Bernard has done.

[theBaron]

Hi, Bernard, mein lieber Husar, that's an old and familiar issue among us collectors. I think for most of us here in this forum, we certainly appreciate repainted (and repaired) Britains for the work that went into restoring them.

I'm not sure the old-school, serious auctioneering collectors have come around to that way of thinking yet, but I think that they might. That is, right now, a repaired/repainted set might tend-tend, I say, I'm not speaking in absolutes-might tend not to fetch the same price in auction as a set with its original paint. But as the number of such sets available dwindles, and the older generations who still received those sets as kids and played with them die off, I think they're replaced by collectors who don't mind the rework.

I think your analogy to antique furniture is a good one, because I seen that same development take place in the furniture market. The time was, when repairs knocked a serious percentage off a piece's value, without exception. But now, there are so many talented and reliable restorers available, who do exceptional work, that a repaired piece, while not worth as much at auction as a mint or near-mint piece, still commands a high price, indicating that there are buyers who will accept the repairs, to have such a piece in their collection.

I think the same thing goes for us, and we're seeing this develop now.

As for new pieces, made from new castings, well, that gives a collector who likes the look of the classic toys soldier the opportunity to start a collection, if he might not otherwise be able to afford originals, and it gives us who like to paint our own a clean canvas to work on. And for those who collect the originals, the new casters also make figures Britain didn't make, or to paint castings as units not in Britain's catalog. London Bridge is a definite recommendation, BTW

Prost!
Brad

[thebritfarmer]

I am in two minds about this.

I love my soldiers to look as new as possible, but with the older sets I also like the used look as it adds to the character. I have some lead farm animals that have a lot of paint wear but it doesn't bother me as when I look at them I just see the many happy hours some young child must have had playing with them. I think that I would rather keep the old sets as is and have newly painted recasts.

[theBaron]

I am in two minds about this.

I love my soldiers to look as new as possible, but with the older sets I also like the used look as it adds to the character. I have some lead farm animals that have a lot of paint wear but it doesn't bother me as when I look at them I just see the many happy hours some young child must have had playing with them. I think that I would rather keep the old sets as is and have newly painted recasts.

That's a good point, BF, and I agree. I have to clarify what I said earlier, I'm talking about figures or sets that are in need of repair. I'm with you about the character of a toy soldier that has been played with, but is not worn. That's our version of "patina" in other collectible categories. I wouldn't repaint those kinds of figures or sets.

If there's significant paint loss (maybe 40% of the surface or more) and/or missing parts, then I would look on it as a candidate for repair.

Prost!
Brad

[kilted vampire]

I have always had a mind to repaint the 'orrible! Never had a problem with it. Purists can have their world I have mine. Guess who seems to be having more fun? I can go find something in a sad shape and put a smile on the figures' face as well as mine or any of you whom have seen my work or Jeffs'.
I bought some figures where the paint traces told me what colors were or had been and I was off to the races!:D:D It has never really been about value, though I do appreciate when something I have rises in value. But, I do not lose sleep over it when it loses value either. I rarely buy "mint". I like to play! If money were no object who knows.....:confused:

[Leadmen]

I do recasts at times. Civil war Navy gunners guys I picked up at Chicago. J

[Leadmen]

Another view. J

[kilted vampire]

Another view. J

Those are nice. Holding out on me John? I thought we were friends?????

[Al Fisher]

Why buy recasts when you can get most WB figures at a reasonable price on eBay? (Of course, in my mind, anything is reasonable when compared to K&C and Figarti figures!) Sure, you have to replace parts and repaint them, but it gives you latitude in making the figures more realistic. As an example, you can replace that arm cast tightly against the body of a marching figure with an arm in a more natural position. On cavalry figures, that static lance pennion and cap lines can be replaced with something more dynamic. Almost any part can be replaced with something more realistic . . . or in the worst case scenario, kit-bash a single part, then make a mold and cast as many as you need.

In my humble opinion, it make the hobby much more interesting while improving the look of your figures.

Al

[Cardigan600]

Why buy recasts when you can get most WB figures at a reasonable price on eBay? (Of course, in my mind, anything is reasonable when compared to K&C and Figarti figures!) Sure, you have to replace parts and repaint them, but it gives you latitude in making the figures more realistic. As an example, you can replace that arm cast tightly against the body of a marching figure with an arm in a more natural position. On cavalry figures, that static lance pennion and cap lines can be replaced with something more dynamic. Almost any part can be replaced with something more realistic . . . or in the worst case scenario, kit-bash a single part, then make a mold and cast as many as you need.

In my humble opinion, it make the hobby much more interesting while improving the look of your figures.

Al

Yo Trooper Al, wouldn't that be great if it were the case ie: "why bother with recast when you can get most WB on ebay at a reasonable price". Thats my problem, need two Regiments (Hussar Uniform 19th Century) to complete all the regiments. Try buying a set of WB 10th Hussars in box anywhere on the planet, if you did find a set you would be looking at $600.00 Dollars up if your lucky :(. The other the 19th Hussars were never made by anyone I know of, so need poor old over worked Jeff to help out when he can find the time, or have to get them made special. Last item a Britains # 2150 Centurion Tank, hope to pick one up someday, its a rather special item for me, seeing as I spent six years riding around in one (Happy Days). :D
Bernard.

[theBaron]

Another view. J
Nice job on your gun crew, J. Looks like a little bit of washing on the bucket and the gun carriage?

Prost!
Brad

[Leadmen]

Those are nice. Holding out on me John? I thought we were friends?????

No holdout Michael> :) I bought these figures at Chicago Show a few years back. Don Peilin who promotes the show was selling some at his table. I thought I saw them recently. Maybe he still has some. The three figures came in a box that they casted.If you can find his address on show advertisements maybe you could order a set.:confused: They are solid castings. John

[Leadmen]

Nice job on your gun crew, J. Looks like a little bit of washing on the bucket and the gun carriage?

Prost!
Brad

Brad: I picked up the three figures for the gun at Chicago Show. The gun and bucket are from Conte's pirate gun set. John

[theBaron]

Ah, well, if you had painted them, it would have been kudos to you ;)

But it's a nice set you've got!

Prost!
Brad

[Al Fisher]

I've more than 20 WB charging lancers bought over the past couple of years with average price about $8 each. Of course they needed repairs and repainting, but you seem to be good at that. I've made molds of the legs and arms, cut off the lance lines and replaced with more realistic wire, replaced swords with flattened pins, et cetera and repainted. WHile I don't have red boxes from WBs, I do have repro red boxes should I want to display them that way. Yes, it takes time to do this, but given some of the pictures you posted you must be a human dynamo!

I do groups of ten cavalrymen, with officer, bugler or standard bearer, and eight troopers. So far I've done the 16th Lancers charging, Scots Dragoon Guards in winter cloaks, 2nd Dragoon Guards, RHA, and Massachusetts Volunteer Militia (my grandfather's outfit), plus working on cloaked Prussian Death Head Hussars. Have recently switched my attention to restoring an AQM 11th Hussar (Cherrypickers) 20 piece band with escort, so have not spent much time on WBs. Have also finished about 20 or more 18-piece infantry units . . . all cast, mostly from home-made molds. No arms molded to the body here . . . all are swinging like infantry on parade.

I probably have well over a hundred WB cavalrymen stripped and ready to restore. But then there's the AH ski trooper, British camel rider, and Chasseur Alpines masters waiting to have molds made. Ah yes, the dozen camels are partially painted as well as the French naval officer to go with the CPO and 16 matelots already painted. The Bleriot XI conversion is nearly done . . . at my rate of work it'll only take another month or two.
Fortunately, I'm only 75 so have time to finish them.

My point here is that things take time and don't happen overnight. As you've probably discovered from your recent casting (very nice results, by the way), planning and research is half the fun. So, young whippersnappers such as yourself should stop whining and start working! Just kidding there, but I think you get the point. I've only been serious about this for the past 20 yrs or so, but feel that I've done a lot in that time. Even written a monogram on how to do all of the above . . . unfortunatley, hopelessly out of date by now! You've a lifetime to pursue the hobby, so don't dispair and have fun. (As you obviously are.)

End of sermon . . . would someone play a hymn so we can have the collection?

Al

[Leadmen]

Ah, well, if you had painted them, it would have been kudos to you ;)

But it's a nice set you've got!

Prost!
Brad

Here are figures from Britain molds that I made and painted. J

[Leadmen]

Egyptian Infantry, Japanese Army and naval figures above picture.

Sudan Infantry made from molds. J

[Leadmen]

Indian Army from a rare early set. J

[Leadmen]

West Indie Regt. Painted in Britain's style with "google" eyes. I have not done any molding or casting in two years. I do have other sets I have primed. J

[theBaron]

Impressive parade!

How about the four standing figures in the background, the Highland, the Napoleonic cuirassier and the other two, what's their origin? I almost thought they might be out of Tradition's catalog.

Prost!
Brad

[Leadmen]

Highlanders casted along with some other figures or conversions. J

[Leadmen]

Highlanders kneeling and firing from molds. prone figures also. J

[Leadmen]

Another picture of the Highlanders. J

[Leadmen]

Highlanders and Imperial Gatling gun above. Last pic of this group. Some Trophy and K&C glossies. J

[Leadmen]

Impressive parade!

How about the four standing figures in the background, the Highland, the Napoleonic cuirassier and the other two, what's their origin? I almost thought they might be out of Tradition's catalog.

Prost!
Brad

Those four are early K&C glossy guys. John

[Leadmen]

The four K&C are Sgt. Major and three Napoleonics. J

[maddadicus]

Highlanders and Imperial Gatling gun above. Last pic of this group. Some Trophy and K&C glossies. J

John, it is because of you ,that I started to collect the old style glossy soldiers again..Grew up with them, but drifted to the dark side ( matte ) for awhile..I cannot paint as well as most on this forum, so if some of your stuff should ever need a new home ( Sudan set, Naval Brigade hint..hint..)let me know...Love your collection, everytime you show them...Michael

[Leadmen]

Thank you Michael. I would let you know if I decide to downsize. John

[4th Hussar]

Highlanders kneeling and firing from molds. prone figures also. J

With something like this series of sets , why the heck would you want matte???? Too lovely.......................

[bromhead]

The four K&C are Sgt. Major and three Napoleonics. J


Wonderful work,,I had a past business .part of which was restoring old Britains etc for some local fla collectors,also how I could afford to collect in the past so I bought up every bad shape old glossy I could find,,now of course they no longer seem to be around and I belive a few shops in england sell restored Britains in red boxes,,Of course I never sold a restored-repainted figure as genuine.. The high light of those times was doing three 1890s Cavalry ,totally broken w no paint,series 1? to the request of the collector friend as new.

[DMNamiot]

Hi John

Do you do your own castings? If so please drop me a PM or an email.

Great looking sets!

Dave

[Dickbuttons]

Another picture of the Highlanders. J

Excellent display -- really nice.

Dick